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Residents, Civics Take Stand Against Kings Park Pre-Cast Concrete Biz

Residents ask Smithtown Zoning Board to deny owners' request for a certificate of existing use after years of inactivity; cite noise and odor issues.

Clarification: The previous owners of property at 110 Old Northport Road was Carbro Industries, which is a different corporate entity than previous reported Carlson Associates. 

More than a dozen residents spoke out against a Kings Park company's continued operation of a pre-cast concrete business on Old Northport Road Tuesday night before Town of Smithtown's Board of Zoning Appeals. 

Property owners KPE II of Westbury appeared before the BZA seeking a certificate of existing use for its non-conforming pre-cast concrete business on land zoned Light Industrial at 110 Old Northport Road. John Armentano, a Uniondale-based attorney representing KPE, said concrete manufacturing and related uses have been performed on the property since the 1950s. 

"We're looking for a certificate of existing use that pre-dates the town's zoning codes. The use of concrete manufacturing was not permitted based on a zoning ammendment in 1968, but these uses have gone on quite a bit before that," Armentano said. 

However, residents say KPE's recent use of the property after years of inactivity on the site have created noise and odor issues, significantly impacting their quality of life. 

"In my own backyard I hear loud booms that sound like explosions late into the evening," said Commack resident Daryl Goodman. 

Homeowners along Annandale Drive said Carbro Industries, previous owners of the site until 2011, had gradually discontinued many of its manufacturing activities and never performed as much concrete crushing, never had the same volume of trucking traffic that KPE seeks. 

Under Smithtown town code, planner David Flynn said if a person or business with a legal non-conforming use abandons operation for more than 12 consecutive months, it can not continue. 

"I can tell you with 100 percent certainty it was abandoned, the use discontinued and nothing was going on. Trucks were not rolling in. I actually walked down to the property and inquired about the purchase price," said Commack resident Steven Silverman. 

The owners of Carbro Industries, had filed a request for a change of zoning from Light Industrial to Residential with the Town of Smithtown in 2006, hoping to initally sell to a housing developer.

Armentano said Carlsons' reduction of business as they prepare to shut down and sell the property is not abandonment, which is complete intentional cessation' according to New York State Law.

"A dwindling of an operation is not complete cessation, you need 100 percent stoppage. Even though  the operations are not as loud as they once were, the Carlsons - the prior owners - were still operating, selling materials and working on the site" KPE's attorney said. 

However, Arementano said he has not seen any business records from the Carlsons for 2008 - 2011. The burden of proof to show continuous industrial use of the site falls on KPE based on previous Smithtown Zoning Board decision, according to Flynn. 

Others argued that KPE's intended uses of the property for pre-cast concrete cesspool manufacturing, a concrete manufacturing plant, trucks and heavy equipment repair and storage, recycling broken concrete and concrete crushing are different from the Carlsons' business. 

"I can assure you that the use I had witnessed growing up and being in the area is certainly not the use that is going on there now. Carlson use may have been ancillary stockpiling, trucking and things that went with manufacturing of cesspool ring," said Anthony Tanzi, BZA member and Kings Park resident. "It seems the primary use has become rock crushing, trucking." 

Armentano said under the Carlsons' the property had several primary uses from pre-cast concrete cesspool rings and concrete manufacturing to wielding and its offices. 

Flynn said the issue of whether or not some of KPE's 12 uses requested were originally only accessory or secondary uses could have an impact on whether KPE gets its certificate of existing use. 

"In this case, the Board's role is sort of like a jury, and this is a trial of fact. They will be looking at conflicting testimony and weighing it," he said. 

Both Commack Civic Association and the Townline Road Association representatives made statements that they are opposed to KPE getting a certificate of existing use for their business. Both civic groups are afraid what impact it could have on pending zoning appeals for nearby property owners. 

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Just a short thought to get the word out quickly about anything in your neighborhood.
Share something with your neighbors. Write a new post... What's up? Make an announcement, speak your mind, or sell something
GM May 21, 2013 at 11:29 pm
Well run Gentlemen! Get some sleep now.... you guys have a lot of work to do.
Commackvoter May 21, 2013 at 11:27 pm
Congratulations Steve and Jim!!! Way to go. We are looking forward to seeing you work in your newRead More positions!
LaJa May 21, 2013 at 09:03 pm
They change the name occasionally but they are and will always be TaxPac
LaJa May 21, 2013 at 09:02 pm
Simply stating that you are not aware of who you are supporting is ecactly why the rest of us areRead More relentless in our efforts to keep them out of our community. For the sake of your kids, your property value and future (both near and distant) research this Group. You will be shocked to read the Exact words used by the group you support in TaxPac literature. Then read about the effects of their policies on the communities the infiltrate. And how long it takes these communities to recover once they are all voted out of office.
Dawn-Marie Bailey May 21, 2013 at 04:45 pm
LaJa. First, I don't hide behind initials or some fake name. I can't take you seriously when youRead More won't reveal who you really are. Secondly, I am not part of any group whatsoever. I do not need others telling me how to think. There ARE citizens in this town who are not happy with the current board and their ways, who do not need to be part of an organization of some sort to try and initiate change. Finally, it's funny you accuse me of being a part of something that I don't even know what it is. I've never heard of TaxPac in my life.
Dawn-Marie Bailey May 21, 2013 at 08:18 am
Last night, I had quite the email exchange with members of the PTA Executive Committee. Not onlyRead More could they NOT provide me with an answer as to why they've chosen not to support Proposition 2, all I received was snide remarks and avoidance. Not smart or professional at all. In fact, they seem like quite the joke. I guess they are more of a social club who makes decisions about an important vote without doing their homework and then pushes that decision on the community (via street signs and phone calls to parents). I believe the public deserves a valid answer as to why they've taken their position. Unfortunately, they can't provide one. It makes me ponder if I should even bother to support the PTA in the future (as I have in the past with both my time and money). They certainly don't seem to be making decisions in the best interest of our children. It is all quite sad.
Dawn-Marie Bailey May 21, 2013 at 10:53 am
Last night, I had quite the email exchange with members of the PTA Executive Committee. Not onlyRead More could they NOT provide me with an answer as to why they've chosen not to support Proposition 2, all I received was snide remarks and avoidance. Not smart or professional at all. In fact, they seem like quite the joke. I guess they are more of a social club who makes decisions about an important vote without doing their homework and then pushes that decision on the community (via street signs and phone calls to parents). I believe the public deserves a valid answer as to why they've taken their position. Unfortunately, they can't provide one. It makes me ponder if I should even bother to support the PTA in the future (as I have in the past with both my time and money). They certainly don't seem to be making decisions in the best interest of our children. Now, this morning, I hear that the PTA is telling people that they are opposed to Proposition 2 in order to keep "special interest groups" from taking over. How can parents in this community, whose children are in the system, who want to make positive change for those children, be a "special interest group"? It blows my mind, how in politics, people can twist things so badly to meet their own agendas. It is all quite sad.
Concerned Commackian May 21, 2013 at 01:34 pm
Whatever you say LaJa......whatever you say. Where is the sneaking around? Wasnt everything doneRead More according to the law? I think your goal is sensatuionalism rather than serious debate.
LaJa May 21, 2013 at 11:12 am
By the way, I am not in any way associated or affiliated with any union... If you and your groupRead More are not affiliated with TaxPac then you should know that the platform Tampellini and Hartman support, along with the sudden urgent need for 2 more board seats, is taken straight from the TaxPac play book. You can agree with them, as that is your right BUT you must also know where their rhetoric originates and educate yourselves as to what TaxPac as a group wants here on Long Island. If the TaxPac agenda was above board and positive for LI communities there would be no need for them to sneak around and attempt to gain entry into communities through back-door maneuvers like the sudden need for 2 more seats...when Fusco couldn't get in last year either..... At least know that you are being played.
Concerned Commackian May 21, 2013 at 10:39 am
Is TAXPAC a word often used by Union Shills?
Dawn-Marie Bailey May 21, 2013 at 08:19 am
Last night, I had quite the email exchange with members of the PTA Executive Committee. Not onlyRead More could they NOT provide me with an answer as to why they've chosen not to support Proposition 2, all I received was snide remarks and avoidance. Not smart or professional at all. In fact, they seem like quite the joke. I guess they are more of a social club who makes decisions about an important vote without doing their homework and then pushes that decision on the community (via street signs and phone calls to parents). I believe the public deserves a valid answer as to why they've taken their position. Unfortunately, they can't provide one. It makes me ponder if I should even bother to support the PTA in the future (as I have in the past with both my time and money). They certainly don't seem to be making decisions in the best interest of our children. It is all quite sad.
Commackvoter May 20, 2013 at 10:24 pm
I know what the word increase means! You mentioned it above about insurance rates going up. You seeRead More when a member of the BOE gives his kid a job in the district, then that adult child (24 yrs) takes a 15 yr old student to a hotel for sex and gets arrested, then our insurance company has to pay to settle the lawsuit, dont you think our insurance rates go up John. Sure you dont believe it - Read all about it http://www.newsday.com/long-island/suffolk/cops-commack-hs-coach-faces-sex-abuse-charges-1.1711455 Time to break up this 5 member coffee clotch and their you scratch my back I will scratch yours.
John Smith May 20, 2013 at 10:12 pm
Can I ask you an honest question? I hope this doesn't sound to condescending because I really amRead More curious. Do you understand what the word "increase" means?
Judge for your yourself whether these signatures were written by the same person
MJS May 21, 2013 at 05:30 am
JSMITH - I have no desire to run for the Board b/c I for one believe you and other people like youRead More aren't worthy of people like me and others, like Mr. T and Mr. H, who want to make a difference and are willing to make the sacrifices needed to do it.. You don't deserve them..but thankfully they are more altruistic than I am so they are willing to ignore the hatred spewed by minority voices of people like yourself who try to keep the status quo and preserve their self-interested agenda.
GM May 20, 2013 at 10:30 pm
It's always interesting to watch the fear in the faces of this Board and its operatives when theyRead More are opposed. At present, the power is with too few people and perhaps the community will agree it's time to balance the power by voting YES for Prop 2. Why would a democracy vote down more representation? We fight for more representation in congress so why does the same argument not apply here.
John Smith May 20, 2013 at 10:15 pm
MJS - that I agree with you on. There are definitely people just waiting to see if Prop 2 passesRead More and are prepared to run. You and your Tax Pac buddies - they want to get 4 seats (including Tampellini & Hartman) so they can run us into the land of 7% tax levy increases like Baldwin and Sachem with their poorly thought out short term solutions! Thanks for helping to make that clear. I appreciate the help.
Concerned Commackian May 20, 2013 at 03:45 pm
Im concerned with the rate of spending increases. You cant talk your way around them no matter howRead More hard you try. And as to this "district has no control" argument, thats a cop out and you know it. While the state tells the district what percentage of salary it must pay into the retirement system, if the district had done a more effective job of limiting the growth in compensation, not only would salary expense been lower, but the amount paid into the retirement system would have been lower as well. And John, care to calculate how much the additional state aid to the district this year lowered the levy? Im sure you dont.
John Smith May 20, 2013 at 02:19 pm
Or you could think about how spending is going up over 4% (the majority of which is fueled by costsRead More that are mandated by law -- Teachers' and Employee's Retirement and Insurance contributions -- over which the School District has no control), but the tax levy is only going up 2.91%, which means the School District -- gasp -- might be doing a good job finding alternative sources of funding other than the taxpayers. Again, look at the info for yourself, not through the eyes of a biased Tampellini/Hartman/Tax Pac supporter.
LaJa May 21, 2013 at 10:41 am
Perhaps you can double down your efforts in Lisa Levine's current town of residence. See how thingsRead More work out there for about 5-7 years. Send us a report and we will take it under advisement. Communities working together!
LaJa May 21, 2013 at 10:38 am
As usual the TaxPac group resorts to name-calling and bullying. Much like the school yard loud mouthRead More who simply could not get the other kids to agree with him. Must be getting increasingly frustrating to all of you. Year after year you try to break onto our community intent on doing damage and year after year you are turned away at the gates. Perhaps it's time to pack up and retreat.
TheRube43 May 21, 2013 at 08:53 am
Something jumps out at me. "We don't want to spend down our unrestricted reserves or we willRead More be like Sachem. But if the district doesn't over budget line items then they have no choice but to spend those reserves. Things happen during a school year - whether it is a special ed student moving in or a superstorm causing all sort of havoc. So the district has to overbudget so they have enough for those contingincies.". We have a contingency fund for emergencies. Things DO happen. We spend from the contingency fund. Next budget, we replenish the fund. We never let the fund diminish past the year it was tapped. Overbudgeting for "more emergencies" seems wasteful. People would understand if there was a budget increase due to a catastrophic emergency - enough to cover the dip into the contingency fund. And where is it spelled out what's "budget" and what's "overbudget" for each line item?? I'm not trying to be snarky - I'm just trying to get a handle on things.
Dawn-Marie Bailey May 21, 2013 at 10:54 am
Now, this morning, I hear that the PTA is telling people that they are opposed to Proposition 2 inRead More order to keep "special interest groups" from taking over. How can parents in this community, whose children are in the system, who want to make positive change for those children, be a "special interest group"? It blows my mind, how in politics, people can twist things so badly to meet their own agendas. It is all quite sad.
Dawn-Marie Bailey May 21, 2013 at 08:20 am
Last night, I had quite the email exchange with members of the PTA Executive Committee. Not onlyRead More could they NOT provide me with an answer as to why they've chosen not to support Proposition 2, all I received was snide remarks and avoidance. Not smart or professional at all. In fact, they seem like quite the joke. I guess they are more of a social club who makes decisions about an important vote without doing their homework and then pushes that decision on the community (via street signs and phone calls to parents). I believe the public deserves a valid answer as to why they've taken their position. Unfortunately, they can't provide one. It makes me ponder if I should even bother to support the PTA in the future (as I have in the past with both my time and money). They certainly don't seem to be making decisions in the best interest of our children. It is all quite sad.
Commackvoter May 19, 2013 at 11:28 am
Yes John Smith, agree that the PTA SHOULD have video taped and posted it somewhere for the communityRead More to view. This is the 21st century and there is no excuse for them not offering this for those who could not attend. Same goes for the CUFSD but at least the law prohibits them from banning taping public meetings.